Sweeping in from pub
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:::::: It's probably also worth mentioning to new users the differences between WV and the Big W. They're probably familiar with WP, and it would provide a good starting frame of reference. Like the fact that we have less strict policies and procedures. (Cool!) But we also have a smaller userbase, so article quality may be uneven. (Bummer!) However, this means your efforts will have a bigger impact. (Cool!) I don't know -- stuff like that. Thanks for listening all! --[[User:ButteBag|ButteBag]] ([[User talk:ButteBag|talk]]) 15:14, 7 December 2016 (UTC)
:::::: It's probably also worth mentioning to new users the differences between WV and the Big W. They're probably familiar with WP, and it would provide a good starting frame of reference. Like the fact that we have less strict policies and procedures. (Cool!) But we also have a smaller userbase, so article quality may be uneven. (Bummer!) However, this means your efforts will have a bigger impact. (Cool!) I don't know -- stuff like that. Thanks for listening all! --[[User:ButteBag|ButteBag]] ([[User talk:ButteBag|talk]]) 15:14, 7 December 2016 (UTC)
::::::: Usually when it is clear someone came to WV from Wikipedia the {{tl|wikipedian}} message is used to welcome them, which has a pointer to [[Wikivoyage:Welcome, Wikipedians]]. Suggestions for making that page easier to find would be a great addition. -- [[User:Wrh2|Ryan]] • ([[User talk:Wrh2|talk]]) • 15:46, 7 December 2016 (UTC)
::::::: Usually when it is clear someone came to WV from Wikipedia the {{tl|wikipedian}} message is used to welcome them, which has a pointer to [[Wikivoyage:Welcome, Wikipedians]]. Suggestions for making that page easier to find would be a great addition. -- [[User:Wrh2|Ryan]] • ([[User talk:Wrh2|talk]]) • 15:46, 7 December 2016 (UTC)
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== New way to edit wikitext ==
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<div class="plainlinks mw-content-ltr" lang="en" dir="ltr">
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'''Summary''': There's a new opt-in Beta Feature of a [[:mw:2017 wikitext editor|wikitext mode for the visual editor]]. Please [[Special:Preferences#mw-prefsection-betafeatures|go try it out]].
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We in the Wikimedia Foundation's Editing department are responsible for making editing better for all our editors, new and experienced alike. We've been slowly improving [[:mw:VisualEditor|the visual editor]] based on feedback, user tests, and feature requests. However, that doesn't work for all our user needs: whether you need to edit a wikitext talk page, create a template, or fix some broken reference syntax, sometimes you need to use wikitext, and many experienced editors prefer it.
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Consequently, we've planned a "wikitext mode" for the visual editor for a long time. It provides as much of the visual editor's features as possible, for those times that you need or want wikitext. It has the same user interface as the visual editor, including the same toolbar across the top with the same buttons. It provides access to the [[:mw:citoid|citoid service]] for formatting citations, integrated search options for inserting images, and the ability to add new templates in a simple dialog. Like in the visual editor, if you paste in formatted text copied from another page, then formatting (such as bolding) will automatically be converted into wikitext.
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All wikis now have access to this mode as a [[:mw:Beta Features|Beta Feature]]. When enabled, it replaces your existing [[:mw:Editor|wikitext editor]] everywhere. If you don't like it, you can reverse this at any time by turning off the Beta Feature in your preferences. We don't want to surprise anyone, so it's strictly an ''opt-in-only'' Beta Feature. It won't switch on automatically for anyone, even if you have previously checked the box to "{{Int:Betafeatures-auto-enroll}}".
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The new wikitext edit mode is based on the visual editor, so it requires JavaScript (as does the [[:mw:Extension:WikiEditor|current wikitext editor]]). It doesn't work with gadgets that have only been designed for the older one (and ''vice versa''), so some users will miss gadgets they find important. We're happy to [[:mw:VisualEditor/Gadgets|work with gadget authors to help them update their code to work]] with both editors. We're not planning to get rid of the current main wikitext editor on desktop in the foreseeable future. We're also not going to remove the existing ability to edit plain wikitext without JavaScript. Finally, though it should go without saying, if you prefer to continue using the current wikitext editor, then you may so do.
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This is an early version, and we'd love to know what you think so we can make it better. Please leave feedback about the new mode [[:mw:2017 wikitext editor/Feedback|on the feedback page]]. You may write comments in any language. Thank you.
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</div> [[:mw:User:Jdforrester (WMF)|James Forrester]] (Product Manager, Editing department, Wikimedia Foundation) --19:32, 14 December 2016 (UTC)
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<!-- Message sent by User:Elitre (WMF)@metawiki using the list at https://meta.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Distribution_list/Global_message_delivery&oldid=15942009 -->
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== 2016 in review ==
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At the beginning of the year a number of people posted their [[Wikivoyage talk:Roadmap#2016 Wikivoyage Wishlist|wishlists for 2016]], and with the year almost over it seems like a good time to look back at how things went. Regarding my personal goals:
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# I had hoped to see the number of site contributors increase, and while there are some new names in [[Special:RecentChanges|recent changes]], sadly any increase appears to have been small.
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# I also hoped to see continued SEO improvement, but unfortunately, after a bounce from the improved interwiki linking, I think Wikivoyage has actually regressed, at least for articles that I watch. This site ''does'' rank well for areas not covered by other travel sites, but as far as I can tell for most destinations WT maintains top billing, while other sites seem to have leap-frogged Wikivoyage in the Google results.
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# On a positive note, it took a late push, but the sub-regions of [[California]] are starting to fill out nicely.
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Some items that weren't on my wishlist that turned out to be highlights included:
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# The [[Wikivoyage:Listing editor]] was significantly updated in August after [[User:Ikan Kekek]] helped spearhead an effort to [[Wikivoyage talk:External links#Revisit policy on linking to sister sites?|allow sister project links in listings]], and there appear to have been thousands of edits since then taking advantage of the fact that listings can now be linked with Wikidata to allow easier retrieval of lat/long and other shared info.
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# [[Special:Contributions/Wrh2Bot|Wrh2Bot]] has made over 12,000 edits this year to flag dead links, clean up formatting issues, and otherwise automate mundane tasks so that editors can focus on more important things. If people have suggestions for further cleanups that they'd like to see automated with a bot, please let me know.
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# [[User:Yurik]] has introduced new dynamic map functions that allow a myriad of extremely valuable capabilities, including [[Template:Mapshape|mapmasks imported from OpenStreetMap]], [[User:Matroc]]'s dynamic [[User:Matroc/Laboratory|map draw]], etc. See [[User:Wrh2/Maps]] for some experiments with these new features. There are still some rough edges to work out, but given the quick pace of development I suspect Wikivoyage's articles will have vastly better maps in a year's time.
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There were obviously many more highlights (and a few lowlights) than what is above, so hopefully others can share their thoughts on 2016, as well as what their hopes are for 2017 - personally my goals will carry over from 2016, I'd also like to put some effort into improving the site's usability and UI, and I'm cautiously optimistic that the status quo bias that often stalls discussions will thaw enough to allow some significant changes to things that haven't changed in over a decade, including some site policies.
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Best wishes to everyone over the holidays, and hopefully we can put some ideas in place to finally make 2017 the year that Wikivoyage fulfills its potential. -- [[User:Wrh2|Ryan]] • ([[User talk:Wrh2|talk]]) • 04:28, 22 December 2016 (UTC)
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:I am increasingly convinced that SEO won't happen unless we deliberately edit certain articles to get rid of "copied" content. It will be a long and tiresome slog uphill, but I can see no other way to do it. [[User:Hobbitschuster|Hobbitschuster]] ([[User talk:Hobbitschuster|talk]]) 04:41, 22 December 2016 (UTC)
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:: Static levels of site contributors is concerning. The same is true of Wikipedia which is experiencing declining contribution rates, although they still have tens of thousands of contributors and have plenty of buffer. Active admins could also be an issue, with most of the work done by only 9 people ([https://tools.wmflabs.org/xtools/adminstats/?project=en.wikivoyage.org&begin=2016-01-01&end= determined as admins committing at least 10 admin actions this year]), and of those a disproportionate amount of heavy lifting is done by the top 2. [[User:Andrewssi2|Andrewssi2]] ([[User talk:Andrewssi2|talk]]) 10:30, 22 December 2016 (UTC)
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:::I don't disagree with the points made in this thread, but I'd like to point out that it's not all about quantity. Quality is important, too. So look at the honor roll of new posters: [[User:De88]] has done a fantastic job on the [[Brownsville (Texas)]] article, among his other edits; [[User:RhinoMind]], who joined in Sept. 2015, has spent quite a lot of time inputting a huge amount of information into the [[Aarhus]] guide, among others; [[User:Halowand]] added a tremendous number of pagebanners to articles about [[Japan]], many of them notably excellent, plus information. These are just the contributors and contributions that come to my mind right now; there were many others, and I feel strongly that the quality of the site and its coverage has improved notably in the last year. [[User:Ikan Kekek|Ikan Kekek]] ([[User talk:Ikan Kekek|talk]]) 11:12, 22 December 2016 (UTC)
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::::I definitely agree with Ikan. The contribution of these new users and others has been amazing, and we should celebrate them :-) Not forgetting all of you admins who work tirelessly 'behind the scenes' for hours every day.
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::::My concern, beyond the number of active contributors, is the number of visitors. Yes, we need people who are willing to give up some of their time to help the site to grow, but all of that only matters if we are reaching 'passive users' as well, i.e. readers who are using the travel guide for its intended purpose. Is there any way of checking this, beyond the possibly inaccurate search engine data? --[[User:ThunderingTyphoons!|ThunderingTyphoons!]] ([[User talk:ThunderingTyphoons!|talk]]) 12:21, 22 December 2016 (UTC)
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:::::Not only admins but other valuable established users like you, [[User:Ypsilon]], [[User:StellarD]], [[User:Hobbitschuster]], [[User:The dog2]], [[User:Erik den yngre]] and many others. And among the valuable new users, one I omitted above is [[User:Wauteurz]]. [[User:Ikan Kekek|Ikan Kekek]] ([[User talk:Ikan Kekek|talk]]) 12:29, 22 December 2016 (UTC)
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== Precipitous drop in Alexa Rank since October ==
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Now Alexa rank is not to my knowledge a scientific measure of anything, but it is cited quite often (including by our own page on [[Wikivoyage and Wikitravel]]), so even if there is no reason beyond "just 'cause" a drop is something that should worry us. Our site seems to have fallen from well above 25 000 (probably in the 22 000s) to an as of today rank of 30,253. Now this might be seasonal, but even if that is the case, this rank is worse than the January First 2016 rank (from which there was a slight but notable downwards trend until about March). Now the advertising hellhole has similarly dropped in rank since about October (from the 7 000s) to an as of today rank of 8,714, but the curve for 2016 does not exhibit any trend that could be construed as seasonal.
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What is happening here? A statistical artifact? Something Alexa does? Something we did right before October? Something we did wrong since October? Random movement? A seasonal effect?
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Should we do something about this? If so, what? [[User:Hobbitschuster|Hobbitschuster]] ([[User talk:Hobbitschuster|talk]]) 04:48, 22 December 2016 (UTC)
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:No idea whether this is real or an Alexa quirk; the same numbers have Uncyclopedia traffic dropping [http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/uncyclopedia.info off a cliff] for no apparent reason. [[User:K7L|K7L]] ([[User talk:K7L|talk]]) 17:43, 22 December 2016 (UTC)
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::I've been tracking our Alexa rank off and on since the WMF relaunch. It has a habit of random precipitous drops and meteoric rises that don't seem to have much rhyme or reason to them. I've given up trying to figure it out. -- [[User:AndreCarrotflower|AndreCarrotflower]] ([[User talk:AndreCarrotflower|talk]]) 18:06, 22 December 2016 (UTC)
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:::Is there some other site that measures whatever Alexa is measuring with more scientific basis to it? [[User:Hobbitschuster|Hobbitschuster]] ([[User talk:Hobbitschuster|talk]]) 19:19, 22 December 2016 (UTC)
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:::: [https://www.similarweb.com/website/wikivoyage.org similarweb] seems like a good alternative with more detail, although still not providing you with that scientific basis.
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:::: I would say that fixating on traditional SEO in an increasingly mobile first world is maybe the wrong way to look at things.We do seem to have the aspiration to build a great product in splendid isolation and then wondering why this isn't more visible. How about:
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:::: * Mobile focus : Are our articles designed for a great mobile experience, or are they just a simplified and stripped down version of the 'main' desktop article?
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:::: * External community engagement : Discussions on the Traveler's pub and article talk pages work for us, but the conversation is invisible from the outside. What if we started moving these conversations to a community site such as Reddit?
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:::: * Social Media : Tweeting the DOTM to our 100 followers isn't really working. We could set up campaigns and use the community to broadcast and amplify through the different channels we all use. Why not have a discussion about best restaurants in #Manhatten over Twitter than the WV talk page and draw in new people that way?
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:::: Just some thoughts. Appreciate all this is effort, but I'm suggesting blue sky thinking rather than just focusing purely on content for our next Google rank. [[User:Andrewssi2|Andrewssi2]] ([[User talk:Andrewssi2|talk]]) 19:59, 22 December 2016 (UTC)
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{{outdent}}
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Hey everyone,
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I leaned a little on the Analytics team, and collected some information for you – plus an invitation for any interested parties to join their public mailing list and ask whatever you want.
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* Alexa's methodology isn't appropriate for sites that don't get a high volume of traffic. I don't know what the cutoff is, but "inappropriate method for this size" may be the main explanation.
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* Traffic to the Wikivoyages is pretty stable.
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** The English Wikivoyage pageviews run around 60,000 per day; a third of your traffic comes from mobile.[https://analytics.wikimedia.org/dashboards/vital-signs/#projects=enwikivoyage/metrics=Pageviews] For comparison, about 40% of traffic to the English Wikipedia comes from mobile; Google has reported that they get more searches in the US on mobile devices than on desktop systems.
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** You get about 15,000 "unique devices" each day.[https://analytics.wikimedia.org/dashboards/vital-signs/#projects=enwikivoyage/metrics=UniqueDevices] I believe that I'm two of your unique devices for today, because I understand that each web browser is counted separately (and I've seen this page once in Firefox and once in Safari today), but with a very small number of exceptions for people like me, each unique device is one person.
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** That number, combined with the previous number, gives you an average of each device looking at four pages. Generally, mobile folks look at fewer pages than desktop folks.
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** You get about 300,000 unique devices per month.[https://analytics.wikimedia.org/dashboards/vital-signs/#projects=enwikivoyage/metrics=MonthlyUniqueDevices]
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Finally, if you want more information, then please subscribe to [https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/analytics the Analytics mailing list], and feel free to ask the volunteers and staff there whatever you want. [[User:Whatamidoing (WMF)|Whatamidoing (WMF)]] ([[User talk:Whatamidoing (WMF)|talk]]) 22:43, 22 December 2016 (UTC)
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:Excellent, thanks ever so much for taking the trouble to provide that --[[User:ThunderingTyphoons!|ThunderingTyphoons!]] ([[User talk:ThunderingTyphoons!|talk]]) 23:03, 22 December 2016 (UTC)
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:Here [https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Research:Unique_Devices#Differences_between_unique_devices_and_unique_users] you can see information about what unique devices represents, you are right that 2 different browsers on the same computer are 2 devices, the best example is a mobile phone and a desktop for the same user, 1 user, two devices. So devices tells you about the "relative" size of your user base but not the absolute number of users you have. In the case of en.wikivoyage, if you assume every single user has two devices you are looking at a userbase of about 150.000 "users" monthly. [[Special:Contributions/71.212.30.134|71.212.30.134]] 01:00, 23 December 2016 (UTC)
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::Replace "very small number of exceptions" with "a relative majority of users at least in the western world", see also [[m:Research:Unique devices]]. The "unique devices" number is about twice the "unique visitors" number comScore used to give us, IIRC (totals are not officially provided yet because they could be misleading, as far as I understand). --[[User:Nemo bis|[[User:Nemo_bis|Nemo]]]] ([[User talk:Nemo bis|talk]]) 10:37, 23 December 2016 (UTC)