← Older revision
Revision as of 16:15, 10 January 2016
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[[Image:Trumpeter-KT.jpg|thumb|Hello, I'm a Trumpeter 2-in-1 1:16 King Tiger. You can buy four of me for that.]]
[[Image:Trumpeter-KT.jpg|thumb|Hello, I'm a Trumpeter 2-in-1 1:16 King Tiger. You can buy four of me for that.]]
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The first meaning of Forge World is if you took [[Games Workshop]] and leveled it up a few times. It's a sub-division of GW and produces resin-cast models for 40k, [[Warhammer Fantasy Battle|Fantasy Battle]], [[Battlefleet Gothic]], and [[Epic]]. Forge World grew from one of the oldest official giant stupid model projects, the early 40K lead Thunderhawk Gunship, which was originally created as a limited edition and routinely thrown at people who won GW contests. The Thunderhawk proved so popular that GW realized there was a serious market for giant stupid models, and thus Forge World was born to provide them, starting with [[Baneblade]]s and suchlike
and
working up to full-sized 40K Titans. Over time it's since gone about producing its own range of models and
own
rule sets for a huge array of different factions, and even has its own home-grown Imperial Guard variants (the badass Death Korps of Krieg and Elysian Drop Troops). The awesome-looking Chaos Renegades for [[Lost and the Damned]] also came from here.
+
The first meaning of Forge World is if you took [[Games Workshop]] and leveled it up a few times. It's a sub-division of GW and produces resin-cast models for 40k, [[Warhammer Fantasy Battle|Fantasy Battle]], [[Battlefleet Gothic]], and [[Epic]]. Forge World grew from one of the oldest official giant stupid model projects, the early 40K lead Thunderhawk Gunship, which was originally created as a limited edition and routinely thrown at people who won GW contests. The Thunderhawk proved so popular that GW realized there was a serious market for giant stupid models, and thus Forge World was born to provide them, starting with [[Baneblade]]s and suchlike
,
working up to full-sized 40K Titans. Over time it's since gone about producing its own range of models and rule sets for a huge array of different factions, and even has its own home-grown Imperial Guard variants (the badass Death Korps of Krieg and Elysian Drop Troops). The awesome-looking Chaos Renegades for [[Lost and the Damned]] also came from here.
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More recently, Forge World has been spitting out gloriously beautiful and horrendously expensive Horus Heresy-era models, meaning every mark of Astartes Power Armor,
Cataphracti
Terminators, and older patterns of Rhino and Land Raider. This, in turn, creates the best and worst things ever
:
re-built, revamped Rogue Trader models. The horrible, goofy weapons, tanks, and dreadnoughts are back, in wonderful, goofy new resin kits. They all look amazingly terrible, but the icing on the cake includes Primarchs like ''[[Horus]] himself'' and ''fukken JETBIKES.'' Yes, Forge World put out pre-Heresy Jetbikes, and they are everything you hoped and dreamed for, including a new forgotten weapon type (the Volkite). And now they also have Mechanicum models too- because who doesn't want to play around with the oft-forgotten Imperial Robots?
+
More recently, Forge World has been spitting out gloriously beautiful and horrendously expensive Horus Heresy-era models, meaning every mark of Astartes Power Armor,
Cataphractii
Terminators, and older patterns of Rhino and Land Raider. This, in turn, creates the best and worst things ever
;
re-built, revamped Rogue Trader models. The horrible, goofy weapons, tanks, and dreadnoughts are back, in wonderful, goofy new resin kits. They all look amazingly terrible, but the icing on the cake includes Primarchs like ''[[Horus]] himself'' and ''fukken JETBIKES.'' Yes, Forge World put out pre-Heresy Jetbikes, and they are everything you hoped and dreamed for, including a new forgotten weapon type (the Volkite). And now they also have Mechanicum models too- because who doesn't want to play around with the oft-forgotten Imperial Robots?
It should be noted however, they are still just a leveled-up version of [[Games Workshop]]; their level of detail and casting quality is rather average by industry standards (though it vastly exceeds GW's own offerings), but they still charge an arm, leg, and at least one of your testicles for most models'''*'''. For scale (aside from the comparison to the right) a Soar Art Works Dora, a 1:35 scale model of a 155-foot railroad gun which is regarded as the largest mass-market plastic kit ''ever'', costs £425, while the ''body'' of a 16-inch tall Reaver Titan costs £415 and requires another £150 minimum for the three weapons, and the Warlord Titan is a back-breaking £1240.
It should be noted however, they are still just a leveled-up version of [[Games Workshop]]; their level of detail and casting quality is rather average by industry standards (though it vastly exceeds GW's own offerings), but they still charge an arm, leg, and at least one of your testicles for most models'''*'''. For scale (aside from the comparison to the right) a Soar Art Works Dora, a 1:35 scale model of a 155-foot railroad gun which is regarded as the largest mass-market plastic kit ''ever'', costs £425, while the ''body'' of a 16-inch tall Reaver Titan costs £415 and requires another £150 minimum for the three weapons, and the Warlord Titan is a back-breaking £1240.
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By comparison, [[Citadel Miniatures]] was founded as a subsidiary company and had its own separate projects outside of Warhammer/Warhammer 40,000 ''(so your opponent can [[Rage]] when you tell him your Forge World model has more direct legal provenance than his old metal models)''. GW also acquired Sabertooth games, which operated as an independent subsidiary, but both were eventually absorbed back into Games Workshop.
By comparison, [[Citadel Miniatures]] was founded as a subsidiary company and had its own separate projects outside of Warhammer/Warhammer 40,000 ''(so your opponent can [[Rage]] when you tell him your Forge World model has more direct legal provenance than his old metal models)''. GW also acquired Sabertooth games, which operated as an independent subsidiary, but both were eventually absorbed back into Games Workshop.
−
So, back to the issue with Forge World
; many
[[Trolls|people]] had an innate dislike for the fact that Forge World models and rules were not actually declared by Forge World *or* Games Workshop to be "officially" part of the game; they would refuse to allow them on the tabletop, since they did not come from a Games Workshop primary rules source (such as a Codex, or the Big Rule Book). Forge World eventually started printing prefaces in their books explaining that their rules were official; but some still claim that since "Games Workshop" itself hasn't come out and said it, that
they remain unofficial. However, since the spines of FW's books have always had the Games Workshop logos on them and the inside front cover have the legal copyright and property notices from GW,
this argument seems specious at best; rather, much like how the Big Rule Book has no actual explicit declaration that rules from White Dwarf are "official", the Imperial Armour books themselves should be considered as canonical (what ever that means in 40k) as GW sources.
+
So, back to the issue with Forge World
. Many
[[Trolls|people]] had an innate dislike for the fact that Forge World models and rules were not actually declared by Forge World *or* Games Workshop to be "officially" part of the game; they would refuse to allow them on the tabletop, since they did not come from a Games Workshop primary rules source (such as a Codex, or the Big Rule Book). Forge World eventually started printing prefaces in their books explaining that their rules were official; but some still claim that since "Games Workshop" itself hasn't come out and said it, that they remain unofficial. However, since the spines of FW's books have always had the Games Workshop logos on them and the inside front cover have the legal copyright and property notices from GW, this argument seems specious at best; rather, much like how the Big Rule Book has no actual explicit declaration that rules from White Dwarf are "official", the Imperial Armour books themselves should be considered as canonical (what ever that means in 40k) as GW sources.
However, as with White Dwarf, GW hates you far too much as a gamer and customer to label any of their rulebooks/codices with edition numbers, much less ensure that their FW rules are always kept up to date with the current edition, and unlike Codices where you can typically determine the edition at a glance, a lot of Forgeworld books superficially "look" similar and may even have exactly the same name ''(to date there have been FOUR books with the title "Imperial Armour Apocalypse" but only two of them have sub-titles)''. This can be a major reason the rules are banned at tournaments, and an opponent might object for the same reason they might object to fighting a Squats army under the current rules - however "obvious" the rules translation might be, some people are uncomfortable playing games across too wide an edition gap, as rules interactions may make no sense at all and/or have utterly pathological balance ramifications.
However, as with White Dwarf, GW hates you far too much as a gamer and customer to label any of their rulebooks/codices with edition numbers, much less ensure that their FW rules are always kept up to date with the current edition, and unlike Codices where you can typically determine the edition at a glance, a lot of Forgeworld books superficially "look" similar and may even have exactly the same name ''(to date there have been FOUR books with the title "Imperial Armour Apocalypse" but only two of them have sub-titles)''. This can be a major reason the rules are banned at tournaments, and an opponent might object for the same reason they might object to fighting a Squats army under the current rules - however "obvious" the rules translation might be, some people are uncomfortable playing games across too wide an edition gap, as rules interactions may make no sense at all and/or have utterly pathological balance ramifications.
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'''As an additional side note''' - this has nothing to do with the perception of FW rules being either powerfully unbalanced or too focused on the narrative, but on reflection, that's no different from the [[skub]] surrounding [[Grey Knights|codex creep]] and [[Tyranids|painful nerfing]] already rampant within "core" GW material. So what's new?
'''As an additional side note''' - this has nothing to do with the perception of FW rules being either powerfully unbalanced or too focused on the narrative, but on reflection, that's no different from the [[skub]] surrounding [[Grey Knights|codex creep]] and [[Tyranids|painful nerfing]] already rampant within "core" GW material. So what's new?
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If a Tournament Organiser decides that they don't want to include Forgeworld rules that is entirely their prerogative as they will want the tournament to be as balanced or as hassle free as is reasonable, especially since FW have a tendency to publish their rules with minor variances across multiple "in-date" books which can be a nightmare to manage, especially where some books have "current" rules alongside other rules which have been superseded elsewhere.
+
If a Tournament Organiser decides that they don't want to include Forgeworld rules
then
that is entirely their prerogative as they will want the tournament to be as balanced or as hassle free as is reasonable, especially since FW have a tendency to publish their rules with minor variances across multiple "in-date" books
,
which can be a nightmare to manage, especially where some books have "current" rules alongside other rules which have been superseded elsewhere.
But these organisers ''(if they are smart)'' will also likely restrict "core" army selections too, so no Unbound lists or may exclude certain FOCs, because in the end which is more unbalanced and [[Cheese|cheesy]]? The guy who takes a contemptor dreadnought in his Combined Arms detachment or the guy who take an unbound army of Heldrakes? (Ha Held Rakes sound scary)
But these organisers ''(if they are smart)'' will also likely restrict "core" army selections too, so no Unbound lists or may exclude certain FOCs, because in the end which is more unbalanced and [[Cheese|cheesy]]? The guy who takes a contemptor dreadnought in his Combined Arms detachment or the guy who take an unbound army of Heldrakes? (Ha Held Rakes sound scary)
−
All that said however there is a somewhat valid reason why someone may be a bit "model-shy" around
forge world
rules and that is information. There are 16
army's
in 40k, and each dex tends to have more then one valid build
,
the Astra Militarum alone has six (tank heavy, artillery heavy, balance, flying circus, infantry spam, veteran spam)
,
From a players perspective throwing MORE
army's
, rules and
moels
only compounds how much they need to consider.
Counting forge world
the number of army lists jumps to over 28
with out
considering supplments or mini-codices with only a handful of options and again, each list can be played in more then one way, and then there are the (admittedly handful) of difference between
forge world
and
game workshop
about the same model "is that the vanquisher with the coaxial? or not?" and then on top of all that you need to consider allies.
while forge world
is legal from any logical standpoint, people are not logical, and may be daunted by just how much new information they have to learn in order to make proper
game play
choices and not lose because they did not know that the Death Korp can give orders to artillery. Again though
forge world
is by any standard as legal as any codex,
but
the other player may feel intimidated by your Space Marine siege army just because he does not know for sure what it can do and chose to walk way from it the same way he would if you brought unbound army made of nothing but riptides.
+
All that said however
,
there is a somewhat valid reason why someone may be a bit "model-shy" around
Forge World
rules
;
and that is information. There are 16
armies
in 40k, and each dex tends to have more then one valid build
;
the Astra Militarum alone has six (tank heavy, artillery heavy, balance, flying circus, infantry spam, veteran spam)
.
From a players perspective
,
throwing MORE
armies
, rules and
models
only compounds how much they need to consider.
By counting Forge World,
the number of army lists jumps to over 28
without
considering supplments or mini-codices with only a handful of options and again, each list can be played in more then one way, and then there are the (admittedly handful) of difference between
Forge World
and
Games Workshop
about the same model "is that the vanquisher with the coaxial? or not?" and then on top of all that you need to consider allies.
While Forge World
is legal from any logical standpoint, people are not logical, and may be daunted by just how much new information they have to learn in order to make proper
gameplay
choices and not lose
,
because they did not know that the Death Korp can give orders to artillery. Again
,
though
Forge World
is by any standard as legal as any codex, the other player may feel intimidated by your Space Marine siege army just because he does not know for sure what it can do and chose to walk way from it the same way he would if you brought unbound army made of nothing but riptides.
== Planet ==
== Planet ==
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* '''Ryza''' - Makes all the coolest plasma stuff because nobody else could keep their act together. Their Titan Legion is the awesomely named Legio Crucius (Warmongers).
* '''Ryza''' - Makes all the coolest plasma stuff because nobody else could keep their act together. Their Titan Legion is the awesomely named Legio Crucius (Warmongers).
* '''Jupiter''' - I know right? Bet you didn't know about this one. It only makes ships. Went totally green though, the hippies.
* '''Jupiter''' - I know right? Bet you didn't know about this one. It only makes ships. Went totally green though, the hippies.
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* '''Lucius''' - First colonized by [[Battletech]] players from the late eighties. Maintains the ancient Legio Astorum, better known as the Warp Runners, and supplies Death Korps of Krieg.
Have an
exclusive patterns for some Titans
,
which are cheaper to produce but not as sweet looking as Mars patterns. Didn't get super-heavy tank STCs for a while, which is why they were one of the few major Forge Worlds that launched Macharius tank production when it's STC get re-discovered, while most others frowned on it as a "poor man's Baneblade".
+
* '''Lucius''' - First colonized by [[Battletech]] players from the late eighties. Maintains the ancient Legio Astorum, better known as the Warp Runners, and supplies Death Korps of Krieg.
They have
exclusive patterns for some Titans which are cheaper to produce
,
but not as sweet looking as Mars patterns. Didn't get super-heavy tank STCs for a while, which is why they were one of the few major Forge Worlds that launched Macharius tank production when it's STC get re-discovered, while most others frowned on it as a "poor man's Baneblade".
* '''Orestes''' - Supplied the Sabbat Worlds Crusade, but got attacked by Chaos Titans. [[Awesome|''And won.'']] [[Dan Abnett]] wrote [[Titanicus|a book]] about it. Presumably get overrun by Chaos with the rest of segmentum during the Night of Thousand Rebellions.
* '''Orestes''' - Supplied the Sabbat Worlds Crusade, but got attacked by Chaos Titans. [[Awesome|''And won.'']] [[Dan Abnett]] wrote [[Titanicus|a book]] about it. Presumably get overrun by Chaos with the rest of segmentum during the Night of Thousand Rebellions.
* '''Stygies VIII''' - Makes awesome guns and ammo, as well as the (apparently rare) [[Leman Russ Battle Tank| Leman Russ Vanquisher]]. Cannot keep their act together, losing [[Vance Motherfucking Stubbs|''two whole Titan Legions'']] to [[Chaos]] and having to get another legion [[Fail|transplanted in.]] [[What|Also is a moon.]]
* '''Stygies VIII''' - Makes awesome guns and ammo, as well as the (apparently rare) [[Leman Russ Battle Tank| Leman Russ Vanquisher]]. Cannot keep their act together, losing [[Vance Motherfucking Stubbs|''two whole Titan Legions'']] to [[Chaos]] and having to get another legion [[Fail|transplanted in.]] [[What|Also is a moon.]]