Gary Collins: Today, we’re going to get into a little controversial subject that has drawn some attention over the last week, and Heath, explain some of the fire and some of the things that have gone on. First, we want to start with, this relates to our previous episode, where we talked about getting your advice from the wrong people. If you get a chance, watch that episode, because it will directly tie into this one, as well.
This one’s going to be about a couple of specific individuals. One, Jimmy Moore, who recently has brought some issues to the spotlight that we want to address. Go ahead, Heath, and talk about what has been going on.
Heath Squier: Absolutely. Another episode, too, this ties into is consuming too many calories can make the fat.
A, we’re going to be touching on exposing Jimmy Moore and his failed diet, along with the advice he’s dispensing is not only hurting himself. It’s also hurting others.
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Recently, I’ve been attacked by him and Diane Sanfilippo. They’ve attacked me personally and my company, and they’re basically making more than a big to‑do about something that is very minor.
We’ve posted a rebuttal online, which actually has brought us much more business, but the specifics about what’s going on is, the FDA had come in and they lab tested a bunch of our product, and all the carbohydrates, and all the net carbs were all 100 percent accurate.
They didn’t like that I used the word high protein on a Paleo Bread page, and they wrote it up in such a way it seemed like a grave atrocity had occurred. Really, all they wanted me to do was remove the world high protein off of the Paleo Bread page, despite it containing a lab‑verified seven grams of protein per slice.
Heaven forbid I have one little incorrect thing, but this sort of minute monitoring, this is being pushed by Jimmy Moore and Deborah Krueger and a variety of other people bugging the FDA to the point, where they’re nitpicking something as minute as the word high protein on the website.
I don’t mind changing that. I changed it in one minute. I sent them a thing saying, “Look, I removed the word high protein. I replaced it with seven grams of protein.” That was it. The Paleo Bread is 100 percent nutritionally accurate, and we actually are the only company that tests our lab results online, and we have complete transparency. That was it for Paleo Bread, by the way. Nothing wrong with this.
Gary: The irony of that is, I’ve seen other products with less protein that say, right on the label, high protein. [laughs]
Heath: Keep in mind, I didn’t say the word high protein on the label. It was on the website.
Gary: That’s crazy.
Heath: It’s a complete smear campaign, what’s going on with Jimmy Moore and Diane Sanfilippo. Now, the second thing is the Carb Zero bread. The FDA writes me, and they talk about the calorie count being different.
Of course, it’s different. They didn’t take into consideration the insoluble fiber amount, and what happens is, the lab runs an insoluble fiber test, and those calories are deducted from the calorie count, because they equal zero. What I did was I sent them the lab test.
I said, “Please review what you’ve posted on it on your website, as it’s not accurate, as our fiber amounts to the equal calories, which is stated on the label.” Once again, Carb Zero bread is nutritionally accurate.
Now, there was a variance in fat, but guess what. It had less fat, it probably even has less calories than we state. Oh my God, and guess what is not in question here. What is not in question is, the bread has zero net carbs, period. It does.
Both of them do. We have a small issue with a designer putting one gram of sugar, which triggered them to write about, “Why is there one gram of sugar when there is zero net carbs?” Guess what? Our lab results show zero grams of sugar, which actually support, guess what, zero net carbs.
Very easy. Sometimes, when you’re running hundreds of thousands of labels and you have as many products as we do, something like that can slip, but we’re talking one gram of sugar, which is in the allowable amount of error.
Guess what? Both Cinnamon and Carb Zero have zero net carbs, lab verified, and guess what. You’re going to get results with our products, because we pay extra money to Medallion Labs, which is the same lab as Quest Bars use, which is a supporter of Jimmy Moore.
They’re owned by General Mills. They’re very big. They have the most cutting‑edge technology for testing, especially, when it comes to low‑carb products. We pay extra money to ensure that our products are nutritionally accurate.
Gary: You’re a little fired up.
Heath: Yeah. What’s actually happening right now is the people that develop recipes in the community are getting upsets, because we’re making a packaged good that’s ready to go.
You can buy it on the shelf. We’re in over 10,000 across, actually, all over the world now, and they’re upset, because, guess what? You take your real world and you use our products together. It’s a transitional paleo food, which enables you to get results.
I posted my before‑and‑afters, where I was, how much weight I lost, and where I currently am this year. Anybody that wants to see my results compared to Jimmy Moore’s, which can be seen in this picture here, this picture specifically outlines Jimmy in 2009, when he stopped eating our products, and now, it shows him in 2014, and this is a current picture at Paleo fx in 2014.
Heath Squier, CEO of Julian Bakery Gets Results Using The Real Paleo Diet!
He has gone on a paleo‑ketogenic rampage, and it’s gotten to the point where he’s consuming so many calories, more calories than his body can possibly process, where that extra calorie amount is being stored as fat.
Gary: That’s the thing we’ve talked about too, is getting your information from the wrong people.
I’ve always had a good relationship with Jimmy, we’ve never had any battles, but I’ve seen the way he’s attacked you, and Deborah Krueger has attacked me personally, too, out of nowhere, and I’ve actually had to block her off all my social media.
That’s getting your advice, again, from people you shouldn’t be getting your advice from. He talks about ketogenic diet, and uses ketogenic everywhere, and he’s misusing the actual name. Ketogenic doesn’t mean consuming large volumes of saturated fat or fats. Ketogenic means producing ketone bodies inside your own body, and utilizing fat, and becoming a fat burner, which you don’t need to consume huge amounts of fat to do that.
Done in proportion, done the right way, you will be ketogenic. You don’t need to eat that one meal that he had on there, was five eggs, five whole eggs, and a stick of butter, and he has eaten this way for years and years. That is almost 2,000 calories in one meal. Michael Phelps, you’re not Jimmy Moore. You’re not an Olympic athlete.
Jimmy Moore Not Exactly An Example Of Health And Discipline.
Taking that principle and teaching people that, I find to be incredibly dangerous, and what do I teach in my books? No extremes. Don’t do extremes. You’ll have all the proper fat contained in animal flesh, in some plants. It’s already there.
You just have to add certain fats, like say you don’t want your eggs to stick, you can throw a little coconut oil in there, or you want to add a little coconut oil or a little butter to your coffee. Not a whole stick.
I remember when that whole “stick in your coffee” came out. I about fell out of my chair. I’m all, “Who would ever do that?” People were doing it, and I was getting emails asking my opinion on that, and I went, “It’s asinine.
You should never do anything like that,” and that’s the problem, and he’s taking something that is a valid concept, and I think he has skewed it so far that people now think that they can eat unlimited amounts of fat and not store fat.
People, fat is fat. If you eat a lot of fat, you’re going to store fat, just like carbohydrates. There’s no difference. You overeat protein, you’re going to store it as fat. He is ingesting far too many calories for his expenditures, and not only that, but one last point is that when you do that, and you add carbs in, it actually multiplies the fat storage now, because now, you’ve become carb sensitive.
I’ve seen this with people who have gone on high, high fat diets. When they add a little bit of carbs, then, they blow up. It’s moderation. Moderation.
Heath: Once again, every gram of fat is nine calories.
Your body only burns X amount of calories per day, if you’ve been at something since 2009, which this picture shows, and now, it’s 2014, there’s something wrong with what you’re doing. This isn’t a personal attack against Jimmy. This is business right here.
He is in business to make money, and what we’re saying is that by preaching this concept of consuming an overabundance of fat is not only endangering himself, but it’s endangering others, and it’s making the whole paleo and ketogenic community look bad, because you can’t be going around teaching weight loss advice and be gaining weight. It just doesn’t make sense. Think about it.
Gary: Yeah. We go nuts over this, and that’s the biggest problem I feel, right now, in the low‑carb community and the paleo community, the mainstream people who everyone…they consider themselves the gods, and if you cross them, you’re instantly alienated.
Here’s my problem with them, and I’ve been blasted. They’ve come at me a little bit on this. “You’re overweight. 90‑plus percent of you are overweight.” All the popular paleo cookbooks, right now, you go and look at them.
First of all, they have no background in anything. Some of these people have never even had professional careers, never even had a job, and then they have no background in health and wellness. They start a blog, they read a book, and now, they’re experts, and now, they’re writing cookbooks, going all over the place, and a lot of them from what I see copy their information.
Some of these supposed paleo expert books, they don’t even reference the material they’re stealing. Some of them just flat‑out steal all of their material, and put it in a book, and say, “Hey, look at my book. It’s so great.”
None of it’s yours because you’re not creative and you don’t have background in anything, and then, people are gaining weight on their books, because I get them as clients. They come to me, and email me, and go, “Oh, I tried that paleo thing. Totally gained weight. I used that “Practical Paleo” book and I got fat.” Because it’s not the proper diet. You’re dealing with people…
Diane Sanfilippo does have somewhat of a background in it, but look at the photos. Again, look at the photos. I won’t say anything. Just go look at the proof, and go look at these people on the Internet and their photos. They’re overweight and their weight fluctuates big time. Not to mention a lot of their employees. If you and your book is so great, why are almost all the people who work for you overweight?
Here’s what really aggravates me. Most of them lost weight right around the release of their book, and now, you see them today, and they’re overweight or even bigger than they were before they said they started paleo.
Heath: They’re complete hypocrites. “Practical Paleo” by Diane Sanfilippo is one of the best‑selling books, and guess what?
My wife’s cousin Sophia was just telling me, “I’m trying to lose this baby weight.” She gained 40 pounds during her pregnancy, and guess what book is in her kitchen? “Practical Paleo.”
Now, “Practical Paleo” is a good book if you strip away the sugar and the starches, but that’s the majority of the recipes in there. There’s a reason. I was always taught you are what you eat, and if you’re consuming foods by a person that has gained weight, or is puffy should you say, and you’re consuming sugar, starch, and too many carbs, you’re going to get puffy. You’re not going to lose the weight.
When Sophia looks at the “Practical Paleo” book, it uses honey, maple syrup, all these natural sources of sugar. Guess what she says? “Paleo isn’t working for me.” All of a sudden, guess what? You have another confused person that’s not losing weight, can’t get results. It’s real simple. Do paleo, lower the carbs, cut the sugar, and there’s so many ways to do it. There really are.
Gary: The same group too now, beginning, remember when these cook books first came out? Over half of them were desserts.
Half the recipes were desserts, because what they’re doing is instead of teaching you what to do, they’re basically saying, “You know what? Don’t worry about it. You can eat all this crap. We’re going to change the ingredients, and we’re going to make it healthy, but you can eat all of it anyway,” and sending a complete wrong message, and that’s why the people I’ve noticed that follow them tend to be overweight.
You’ve got the overweight people teaching the overweight people how to lose weight. That makes absolutely no sense at all, and that’s why you see a lot of them don’t progress, or regress, and I’ve seen a lot of these paleo experts, and now, they’re trying to add in legumes, which are absolutely out in paleo. They’re trying to bring back in beans. They’re bringing in more dairy than you should consume.
Dairy is not part of paleo, it’s part of primal, but even me as a primal guy, I don’t say to consume as much dairy as they’re saying. They’re bringing in these high‑calorie items back in, high‑starch, and then people, they wonder why their blood sugar’s all over the place and why they’re storing fat again.
Why would you go through all that trouble for a bean that has lectins and phytates, which are harmful? You get them in small amounts. Yeah, you can bake them. You can soak them. You can boil them. You go through all this effort to have this bland, mushy bean that’s going to ultimately make you gain weight, and probably, give you gas. I don’t get it.
Why are they fighting so hard for this food that…I don’t get the point. How about you just go eat, I don’t know, maybe some grass‑fed beef? How about that?
Heath: Anything would be better. Bacon’s better.
Gary: Bacon’s better, exactly. Yeah.
Heath: It’s crazy, but you know what? It’s moderation, and once you’ve got it, you won’t ever…you just can’t eat legumes, and if you want to be lean and cut, or have a lean physique without having those puffy arms, you’ve got to cut the beans. [laughs]
Gary Collins Says No To Beans And They Are Not Paleo!
Gary: Exactly, and not only that, but it’s one of those things where you’re just puzzled, because what they’re doing is they’re not giving you what you need. I’ve said this before. They’re giving you what you want, which is the easy, lazy way out.
Now, the shopping list for Walmart. Now, the shopping list for Costco and Target. This is the same person who I watched a seminar of this person, and now, they’re touting…in that seminar they touted, “Go to your farmer’s market. Eat local. Support your local farmer.” Now, all of a sudden, “Hey, I’m going to give you a shopping list for Walmart.”
Hmm it appears Diane has returned to her 1998, and pre- Paleo diet weight. (See recent photo below)
Goodby Farmers Market’s and Hello Walmart!
(Jimmy and Diane have a lot in common, reverting back to their previous weight!)
What a great example for your followers, great job both of you!
* Of all the people I have searched for current photos belonging to the Paleo or health community, Diane was the most difficult to find any recent photos of. When I did find them, they were never full body and always a strange angle. It appears someone is working overtime to make sure that people don’t see, just like Jimmy and many other of her buddies, she has reverted back to her previous weight. I found this to be very concerning, as Diane is out in public and at conferences fairly often, but yet hardly any pictures of it. All false image and no substance, not the kind of people you should be getting your health advice from.
Talk about the absolute bipolar opposite of what we preach in the primal and paleo world, at least what I teach. I don’t know what these paleo people are even teaching anymore. I have no clue. They’re off their rocker, they don’t know what they’re talking about, and you can tell, and that’s what happens.
I want to make this very, very clear, because I got bashed for this, too, because I started ripping on people that had no background in what they were doing. They go, “Well, you come from the FDA. Oh, you were an athlete and bodybuilder back into all this.”
I went, “Yeah, but at least, I have a basic understanding of the concepts.” I didn’t just go to college, start a blog, listen to Justin Bieber in the background, and decide I’m a paleo expert. There’s a big difference, and that’s what you’ve got right now.
You have people that are amateurs teaching people who don’t know anything. It’s lunacy. I don’t even get this anymore, and it’s ruining the movement. It’s tainting the movement because it’s going in the wrong direction.
Heath: Here’s something actually just in I wanted to address.
Jimmy Moore posted this real smear post on his blog, and we posted a rebuttal to it, and pretty much there was nothing to be said after anybody read our rebuttal, but one thing that Jimmy mentioned in there was that “Paleo Magazine,” who we advertise on the back cover of every month, and we love their magazine.
Gary: Yeah, and who I’ve written for, me, as well.
Heath: Yep. We have a great relationship with them. Bryan Azur has been down to our facility and visited us. He just wrote me right now just to respond to Jimmy’s response that they were questioning their relationship with us, which is absolutely ridiculous.
Gary: It was false. That was actually pretty ballsy to put in a blog post like that and call a major magazine company and speak for them without…It was just a fault.
I pointed it out to you. You didn’t even see it the first time. I saw it and I went, “Did you know about this? Because we both know Bryan pretty well, and Cain as well, and I’m like, “I never heard this. Did you hear this?”
Heath: Bryan just wrote back after I emailed him just a little bit ago.
He says, “I did hear about it, and I did see the rebuttal. That it was very strong. It is true we were aware of this situation and looking at both sides and are more than satisfied with your response. We look forward to continuing our relationship with you. Bryan.”
Really, Jimmy? It’s ridiculous. We lab‑verify and test our products. Stop trying to smear our company. We’re trying to give people transitional foods, which take them from eating in a mainstream fashion, which is making people overweight, to eating real foods mixed with our products. It’s very simple. We use very simple ingredients, and what are you going to say against that?
I’ve gotten results. I post my diet and protocol online for everyone to see my results. I got them quickly and I shed the weight ever since. Three years…
Gary: And you’ve kept it off.
Heath: Yeah, and I’ve kept it off, and my pictures prove it.
What do your pictures prove? Because it’s so ridiculous that you’re out there preaching keto and weight loss and you’re trying to be healthy, but you can’t have a waistline of the size that you have and be healthy. Google Mercola’s articles on how the waistline directly affect, has a direct correlation to one’s health. The information is out there, and it’s against you. It’s absolutely crazy what’s going on right now.
There are so many paleo recipe books, and we do sell a lot of these paleo recipe books. But what people need to understand about the recipe books we sell, we have been dissecting those recipe books for years. Dan Lombardi, who was on a previous episode, he is our blogger.
He lives out in Connecticut and he has done recipes with every single recipe book we sell on our site, and guess what he does to every single one of them? He cuts out the sugar and the carbs. He modifies them with our products so that they’re paleo, ketogenic and low‑carb.
Because guess what? A lot of those recipe books aren’t. They’re not ketogenic, paleo and low‑carb, and guess what? Guess why he does that? Because he’s lost a ton of weight himself. He has an autoimmune disorder which he controls by eating our products.
We have helped so many people lose so much weight. We are feeding over a 100,000 people a month right now paleo products and we’re helping them transition to eating real food mixed with our products, and guess what? It gets them real results, just like I’ve gotten, and been able to maintain.
I’m tired of people smearing us. I’m tired of trolls like Deborah trying to crush us and write every single agency out there. Guess what? It’s not going to work, period. You might as well knock it off, because people are getting results, they’re getting healthy, and it’s time that people start looking at who they’re getting their advice from. Are they practicing what they’re practicing? Because guess what? I am.
What a lot of people don’t know about my products is I make them, I formulate them for myself, and I’m sharing with everybody the products I personally consume that got me the results. Because I had allergies, I had brain fog, I had all of these issues, I had joint pain, I was gaining weight. I didn’t understand what was happening to my body when I was around 30 years old.
I started taking all the junk that was clouding my mind and my body out, and I did an elimination diet, and I started developing products around with ingredients that happened to be paleo. That’s how I started formulating all of my products. It’s very simple to make low‑carb products. You just choose ingredients that are low‑carb. It’s not brain science. [laughs]
You start assembling products that are low‑carb to begin with. There’s no mystery in that, and guess what? Then, I send it off to the lab and I test them. In 2009, when Jimmy Moore first brought to my attention smart carb bread it was formulated by my parents and they used computer data to do the nutritional information.
Now, at that time, that wasn’t, we found out that wasn’t the best form of testing products. What we ended up doing was seeding all of our products to be lab‑tested and we weeded out all the ones that weren’t correct. Because in order, if you’re going to be on a diet and you’re going to have a trusting relationship with a person that you’re ingesting their food from, you have to have lab‑verified results.
All of our products are lab‑verified and we have nutritionally accurate products, and because I want you to get results. It’s very simple.
Gary: Why do you want to sell harmful products? Eventually, you lose your consumer. That’s for me, too.
My book is about what I do, about what I’ve done. It’s about my diet, it’s about how I approach things. I even have a small little cook guide that goes along with it that are all my recipes. I didn’t go on the Internet and go copy them off a paleo site like everyone else seems to do, because they’re all the same recipes.
These are recipes I created over years and years of trial and error that were simple, quick, because I was busy. Oh, that’s right, I was a professional. I had a job. I had to do this stuff. I just didn’t go to college and create a blog. I had to create this stuff, and I got results of it, and that’s my life. My body weight fluctuates at a most, at the most during the year, two to three pounds.
What you see, and people are always shocked when they see me in person. They always go, just like Frank said, who we interviewed, he goes, “You look just like your pictures.” He goes, “There’s no BS, there’s no airbrushing, there’s no nothing.” You can go look up my pictures on the Internet and it’s the exact same guy. It’s not that I went and slimmed down for my photo and lost 30 pounds and then gained 40.
That’s why I say go google these people. Go find their pictures. You will be amazed at some of the people you follow, what they look like. You see them in person and it’s even worse, because most of them I’m much older than. Some people I’m old enough to be their dad and I see them in person and I go, [emphatically] “Oh my god.” They look older than me, and they’re in their 20s.
Heath: You mean, you don’t have a degree in just English, Gary?
Gary: No, I actually got, I have a little bit of a science background. I’m not a science expert, and I’m not the paleo science blogger with no science background, whatever that is (Chris Kresser a true idiot).
Heath: You’re not an acupuncturist, Gary?
Gary: No, I don’t claim to be things I am not. I tell people I teach you what I know.
I do have a degree in forensic science. I do have a degree in exercise science. I do have a little bit of a science background. I did have to take college courses in biology and chemistry. Did I work in a lab and am I an expert in this stuff? No.
That’s why my blog is not all science mumbo‑jumbo. That these guys, that’s another thing, a red flag. If you go research their background and you notice that their blog is nothing but a bunch of science articles just put together and they don’t make sense and you don’t know what they’re trying to say, get out of there. Get away from that website. These people are dangerous.
It takes a long, long time to become an expert in chemistry, biology and science. You don’t learn this stuff overnight. You don’t learn it by reading a couple books and proclaiming yourself an expert. That to me is a sociopath. That’s someone who is so out of touch with reality, you should never, and it’s a marketing ploy.
You should never call yourself an expert in something you don’t know much about, even. If you’re overweight, you definitely shouldn’t be teaching people how to lose weight. To me, I just, I don’t even get that. I don’t even understand where that comes from.
I think this is why the vegans take these guys to task. If you go on and you see some of the vegans, they rip these guys to shreds. It’s obvious, because all you’ve got to do is pull up a picture of them and go, “Oh, that paleo thing’s working real well,” and the vegan’s skinny, and the paleo guy’s fat!
We’re getting crushed by these people, and not that me and you, we’re not totally against vegans, either. I feel it has its place, it’s not something I teach long‑term. That’s a whole another issue for another time. But when someone who’s eating nothing, but raw vegetables and plants is pummeling you, you’ve got a problem. You really have a problem.
Heath: What we’re into is optimal health. What Gary and I found is that by eliminating the sugar and carbs from the paleo diet is we have found optimal health and a way to get real results.
It’s an anti‑inflammatory diet at that point once you’ve removed the starch and the sugar from the diet. We’re not no sugar, we’re saying just cut it down to a minimum. This way works for us, and it can work for anybody, and it’s simple, and there’s so many foods you can have that people don’t have to be so restricted.
Now, when this whole crazy Twitter war happened against myself and Jimmy and Diane Sanfilippo, it was crazy how many people from around the world were not only supporting us. But we from every type of paleo person out there, from people saying, “There’s no such thing as a transitional food.”
Guess what? There is. Because honestly, paleo can be hard unless, sometimes, not everybody has the dedication in order to go 100 percent paleo. When you’re transitioning from whole wheat and you want to transition from a mainstream diet to paleo, guess what? Paleo bread’s great, man, I’ve got to say. There’s so many things you can have. You can have a sandwich again.
And guess what? It’s not going to make you gain weight. It’s just not. All you need to do is just change your diet and work out a little bit for phenomenal results. It’s not that hard. When I say, “Work out a little bit,” I really do mean a little bit. You don’t have to go crazy, but you can get such great results. Which leads me to believe, how the heck did Jimmy progress backwards from what was a great weight loss that he had? He’s been progressing backwards.
Which means, once again, going back to too many calories. It’s getting stored on him. He’s taking more calories than his metabolism is burning. You can’t blame that on anything else except for that. It’s very clear, he posts his diet. It’s crazy. Don’t tell me that you’re healthy when you’re that overweight. It’s just nuts.
I’m not picking on him, once again, but he is a business, what he represents is a business, and he’s out there saying, “Eat real foods,” but he’s also recommending Quest Bars and Quest Chips and all these other products.
Gary: Yeah, that was one of his rebuttals is, “I just,” and some of his followers are all, “Well, I just eat real food,” and you’re all, what? He’s advertising processed food right on his website. That’s the problem I have, too.
That’s the hypocritical factor is that’s one thing people always zing back at me and they go, “Well, I just eat real food,” and they’re following someone who says, “Eat real food,” and then you go to their website and they’re advertising all their buddy’s processed foods. I hate to break it to you, Jimmy, butter is a processed food. If it goes through a manufacturing facility and it has to be combined and made and packaged, it’s a processed food.
That’s where I get aggravated too is they start drawing the lines on, “Well, I eat real food because I eat butter.” Nope, butter’s processed, so stop it. Stop it already. They try and do this and they make it real complicated. And me and you, I think they don’t like us either is because we’ve simplified it to just such basics, like the low‑carb. Like they always say, “Oh, low‑carb? I go it’s real carb.”
Nature provides everything in proportion as we need it. I always try and avoid, I use low‑carb here and there, but I try and avoid using it, because it’s a misrepresented term. We’re not talking about a low‑carb diet.
We’re not forcing you to remove carbs that you would naturally ingest in a natural diet, not at all. We’re telling you to eat the right carbs that would be in a natural diet that you would find, you wouldn’t find honey at every other tree and be rolling into almond balls or date balls, or whatever you’re doing. You get it on occasion, and on occasion you would gorge yourself silly, because you wouldn’t find it and that’s totally fine.
I’m not saying gorge yourself on honey, let’s get that straight. But to understand, they’ve removed themselves from nature, and that’s where I’m getting bent out of shape too is they preach this one kind of holistic ancestral health, and then, they just veer way off. If you look at it in simplistic terms, what would you be around nature, in abundance, seasonally?
Heath: Protein. [laughs]
Gary: There you go. There’s your diet, and people, we made it so simple and I explain it so easy. My book’s 150 pages long, my main book.
My other one I think is 160, something around there. Diane’s is like, I used it as a doorstop at one point because I had it and I went through it and I went, “Oh my god, this is so complicated, I don’t even know where to begin,” and I know what I’m taking about.
Yeah. Then, Jimmy’s are like three, four hundred pages. All the other books are 400 pages, and I’m like, “It’s not that hard guys.” I don’t need 400 pages to tell me how to go back and eat what my body naturally wants and needs. I don’t need 400 pages to explain that to you.
Heath: Yeah. Jimmy has written a book called “Keto Clarity,” which is laughable at this point, because how can you have clarity and be overweight? How do you doing a ketogenic diet and be overweight? It’s complete hypocrisy! You don’t do it!
[laughter]
Gary: The thing is it’s not slightly overweight, and this is the sad part.
Because I didn’t realize how far Jimmy had gone until this broke out, because I hadn’t seen a lot of pictures that came out when this Twitter war, and I didn’t get directly in the middle of this. It got pretty ugly. I was too busy trying to build a property and do productive things. Otherwise I might have jumped in.
But I didn’t realize how much weight he had gained, and he’s gained a lot of weight. He’s easily 75, 100 pounds overweight. That’s a problem. That is someone who should not be teaching, and I don’t want to hear, “Oh, it’s a battle of struggles, and it’s this and that, it’s my thyroid and da da da.”
That stuff is all, that is BS, that is lazy, that is everyone deserves a trophy mentality. I’m special, because I fell out of my mom’s womb. No one is special, no one gets special benefits, we’re all the same. Figure it out in that sense as far as eat what you’re supposed to eat, get moderate exercise and you won’t be 100 pounds overweight.
I can guarantee that one. I don’t care what your condition is. Eat healthy and move and you will not be…you may be a little overweight if you have some weird, strange anomaly which is very, very rare, by the way.
Heath: You know you’ve gained too much weight when you’re conducting videos like you and I are doing and you’re sitting there in your chair and your stomach is so big that you’re putting your microphone right here on your stomach, and it’s holding it.
Gary: I saw that. [laughs] I saw that.
Heath: Your stomach is holding up your microphone. Are you kidding me? Microphone on the floor.
I don’t care if you’re slouching or not, it would still be really difficult to pull that off. Honestly, everybody might be thinking we’re really, we’re going too far, we’re attacking his weight and stuff, but what we’re saying is this is business, and when you attack my business, I’m going to attack your business back. I’m not going to be steamrolled.
Our business is helping people to optimal health. What we’re saying, we’re pointing out the differences, I’m providing facts. My company has posted our results online. Our rebuttal is out there. It’s very simple to see that one person, you’re going to get results with my company and his company you’re just not.
You have to practice what you preach. How can you be attending these conferences? You’re making the conference look bad, you’re making our community look bad, you’re letting vegans beat you up because you haven’t achieved optimal health yourself. How can you be out there talking about clarity anything?
Gary: He’s not the only one. There’s a whole group associated that we talk about in private that’s a joke.
These people are literally a joke. I’ve said it more than once. Go do something else. Health is not your area. Go do something else. You know what? You’re doing a disservice, and I get the emails and I have to deal with the questions.
Even Frank when he came on, he had read all the books that you sell and all that and the guy was just completely confused when I met him. He made great strides, but he was starting to regress, and he did it, he admitted it. It’s information overload, because they have to sell you something new. It’s something that they’ve got to keep giving you another book, because they have nothing else to give you and they don’t really know what they’re talking.
I’ve proven this. I’ve read their books and I went, “God, this is great information that you take from somewhere else and dump in a book, but you didn’t explain it correctly, and why do I need all of it?”
That’s always a red flag for me is when a book is so complicated that and it’s 400 pages, it tells me that you don’t understand the information you’re conveying. You don’t know how to relay it to me, the consumer. Instead, it’s going to confuse me. I’ve read these books, and if I’m confused by some of these books, the consumer is completely lost. They don’t even stand a chance.
That’s the thing. All they do is write books. Another problem I have is they’re not authors. They’re just pushing books. I take what I write very seriously. I consider myself an author. I consider myself a professional of what I do. I’m not here just to sell you crap.
If I was here to sell you crap, believe me, I’d just go do something else. I could make a heck of a lot more money doing who knows. I have a professional background, I can get another job tomorrow, but I do this because I’m passionate about it, and you know what? My waist in high school was 28.5. My waist today is 29 to 29.5. And it’s that way all year long.
Heath: I was a 32, 33 in high school, and I’m still the same size now, and I’m six‑two‑and‑a‑half.
I think I went up to like a 38, 39, but I stored most of my weight on my stomach. My predisposed weight gain was in my stomach, guess what I set out to do? Get a six pack. What do I have to do in order to get that six pack, and guess what? It was like 70, 80 percent diet and 20, 30 percent working out.
What does that tell you right there? They have to go together, but you don’t have to work out that hard. You don’t have to overdo it to get great results, and stop complicating it. It’s just so sad. We wanted to put together this video to give you real clarity, not somebody’s lack of clarity.
It’s just, Jimmy Moore has gotten to the point where he’s become a joke and anybody that looks at his information and what he’s doing, I feel that it is endangering at this point. Because you can’t consume that many calories and be recommending taking in that many calories and expect results.
Now, just to clarify, though, being in a ketogenic state mixed with paleo is a great idea, don’t get me wrong. These are two very different things, but it’s called keto done wrong. That should have been in the name of his book, because that’s what he’s preaching right now at this point. I hate to be this harsh, but honestly the guy tried to smear me, I’m just pointing out the facts.
There was no rebuttal for his transformation and weight gain, because guess what? He doesn’t have one. Even if he did, his diet points to the core of his problem and why he’s gaining weight.
Gary: The rebuttal you get, I know you get it too, we both get it, is having a six pack isn’t what all it’s about. Being ripped, I didn’t want to be ripped.
Here’s the thing. Go look at Weston A Price’s book and go look at the cultures he studied. They all had six packs. They’re living out in the middle of nowhere untouched by modern civilization, and they had six packs. Unless they’re obviously in a polar region where they had to store extra fat in order to stay warm.
But I’m talking the more tropical and more moderately climate regions. They all looked like our athletic models of today, and that’s what I mean. I’d heard that snapped back at me a million times. I don’t have time to be ripped. I don’t have time to do this. That’s not my thing. I’m about health. That to me is one of their built‑in excuses is they always give, “Oh, I just want to be healthy.” Well, you’re overweight.
Heath: They don’t go together. Some people were commenting, “Well, his test results look good,” but you can’t be healthy and be overweight.
They don’t go together. When you put yourself out there and you’re going to be, you have to practice what you preach, and that’s the bottom line. Gary and I are going to be doing a number of shows like this exposing the truth, because there’s too much confusion out there.
There really is, and we want to expose a lot of these people and what they’re doing specifically. We will go point‑by‑point down their books and their information and how they’re sinking people’s health. Because you’re not going to reach your ideal weight, you’re not going to be able to maintain your ideal weight, unless you follow certain principles, and the principles that are being shared by many of the authors today won’t get you there.
Gary: No. That’s the thing too is we’re not here just to completely bash people. I think what has happened is me and you have just gotten sick of the bashing.
Some of Jimmy’s little groupies have just pummeled me at times, and just because I’m associated with you, and then they start attacking. It’s a sick little network, and if it’s truly about helping people, then, let’s help people.
I’ll just throw this out there. Jimmy, Diane, all the Victory Belt friggin’ cookbook authors who are overweight, come my way, come our way. We’ll help you for free. I’ll get you to lose the weight, and I’ll get you looking healthy and you’ll better, and we’ll do it for free for you. You come to us and we’ll fix you. How’s that sound? An open forum for them. They can come to us anytime and we’ll tell them how to do it.
Heath: Absolutely, and they can email Gary@theprimalshow.com, or myself, Heath@theprimalshow.com.
Make sure you hit the subscribe button, because there’s going to be plenty more of these episodes coming out. We’re just putting it out there, man. We’re going to tell the truth. We have complete transparency. We’re really, myself and Julian Bakery and Paleo Inc., the companies that I run, we’re all about creating optimal health.
Make sure you check out Gary’s book “The Primal Power Method” on Amazon or iTunes. I think you can get it pretty much any way, and at his site, PrimalPowerMethod.com. You can see my diet and what I did in order to stay this way PaleoInc.com/diet. Julian Bakery is the largest online paleo store, right now in the world, so we sell a wide variety of products that will help you reach your goal.
Needless to say, I think we’re going to be dumping a lot of books here real quick, because at the end of the day, it’s just too much confusion. We’re going to be keeping the ones that are really going to be helping people, and yours is one of them, Gary.
Thanks for making such a great book and thanks for doing this episode with me, because it’s really important that people understand what’s going on.
Gary: Yeah, because I could have easily bowed out and avoided the controversy, but everyone knows my thoughts, too.
People have heard my interviews. They know where I stand on a lot of this stuff. I think it’s just come to head, and it’s come to a point to where these people need to realize we’re sick of it and we’re tired of it, and if you’re going to attack us…
It’s one of those things. I come from a military, law enforcement background, and you punch me in the face, I’m going to knock you down. That’s the bottom line. That’s how it is. I think a lot of these people have gotten a free ride, and they’re such buddy‑buddy and have their little groups that they think they can pick on people and say things and expect nothing in return. They expect you just to sit there and cower and take it.
Not me. That’s not me. That’s not you either. I think they just need to realize, don’t do that. Play fair, be straight, because what Jimmy could have done, what Diane could have done is they could have contacted you and said, “Hey, we’d like to interview you, discuss these latest results,” and instead it was a pure smear tactic, it was underhanded. Diane tried sliding it through Facebook when everyone was on Twitter.
It was nasty, the stuff they do. They think that someone like me who is a former investigator, a professional, hey guys, professional investigator. I went to school for this stuff and several academies and worked in it.
If you think you’re going to slide something past me and you’re going to outwit me, don’t do it, because you’re going to really piss me off is what you’re going to do. I think that’s where it is, is we’ve just drawn our line in the sand and said, “Enough is enough.”
Heath: Yeah. Heaven forbid you say something against them, it’s like, all of a sudden it’s like a complete uproar when they’re out there trying to smear you, they’re trying to back‑link articles on their blogs to push up SEO higher, and there’s so much stuff going on, but enough is enough.
Thanks, Gary, for doing this, again and we’ll talk to everybody soon.
Gary: Yeah. Hey, I use your products, too, Heath, come on.
Heath: Oh, yeah. [laughs] I actually see one in the background.
Gary: Yeah, there’s one back there. It’s the paleo pancakes or waffle mix, it’s excellent. I had some last night.
Heath: Yep. Get results, people, so open your eyes. All right, we’ll talk to you all soon.
Gary: All right.
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