Birju: This week we have Aisha Salem joining us for a conversation - we so much appreciate your availability - all the way from Denmark, Aisha.
Aisha: Thank you.
Birju: Aisha’s background defies description to some extent, but I will do my best to provide an immediate overview. After a seemingly normal upbringing, including university life, business school, marriage and children, she went through an inner shift, driven by a singular question: “Who am I?” The depths of seeking that answer has led to a transformation of thoughts, words, and activities, where today she travels the world, sharing this journey of inquiry with whoever would ask that of her. Today, she’s decided to share some of that journey with us.
Aisha, I would love to start on the discussion topic of turning points. What gets into a young, conventionally successful woman to undergo the level of shift that has happened to you, starting in your early twenties?
Aisha: Are you asking what was behind it?
Birju: Yeah, what was the space that allowed for that kind of inquiry to arise?
Aisha: Actually, there wasn’t any space for it at the time. I was living a completely ordinary life. As such, it came in the dissatisfaction of having worked toward that which was supposed to make me happy. It was just a specific point in time where I just felt how dissatisfying everything I had worked toward was - in terms of creating that picture of life that everyone else was moving toward.
Birju: What was one dissatisfying component as you witnessed it?
Aisha: It was the fact that all of those things that I thought I wanted turned out to be based on a collective consciousness, and the movement of life which is based on the conventional way of thinking. It just showed that none of it was worth anything, basically. It was missing the basic component which was myself. 
Birju: Can you share a little bit about what you mean by the phrase ‘collective consciousness’ - which may not be so familiar to our audience?
Aisha: Basically, in surrender, we fall deeply into the voice of our self, and that self is the voice of our own life. And our own life is filled up with the voices of everyone we ever listened to in that part of being groomed to live as a part of society. So the collective consciousness is basically that state of consciousness that is to a large extent, based on living as individuals, living in the separated state, living according to the ego rather than allowing one to be surrendered to the pure will, which is the revelation of the true heart.
Birju: To make sure I’m understanding what I’m hearing, there is this preprogramming that you and everybody has gone through, that has led us to want what we want. Then when you were in the state of achieving that, you were able to turn around and look back and say “wait a second! This isn’t really what I want.”
Aisha: It was not so much a looking back as truly arriving in this moment - of seeing that which I thought I wanted, based on looking outside of myself. You know, as a kid, we come out like blank sheets…Anyone who doesn’t make that choice of listening to themselves, they do get lost in that collective consciousness ... until everything is questioned, everything is dissected, until everything has been allowed to fall off - basically making one naked in that way of knowing that we don’t know anything. Because at the outset, we can only grasp at whatever knowledge is available to us, and then try to create some kind of world ... a picture of how reality is, based on that. And this of course is what makes up that collective consciousness.
Birju: Thank you for that as background. Now, as you started down that path of questioning, were there others who were involved in that process? Generally speaking, what do you feel is the role of the other in this path - or have you found that it is very much an inner process?
Aisha: Basically, in the tearing down of one’s belief system, we lose everything that this ‘other’ that you are talking about is based on. It became a completely inward inquiry. It became very obvious to me that no one around me knew anything like this and that led me to only ask inwards. Everyone has their ideas; but once you have seen through these ideas, you see the fear based movement which is lying under it. Then you know the only thing you have left to listen to is yourself. That doesn’t mean that we are all alone. But we have to become very selective in who we listen to.
Rahul: I wanted to jump in with a question. In that moment where you arrived at that sense of dissatisfaction and that process of inner inquiry, what was the first manifestation, the first reaction to what would be observable from the outside? Or was it just something that no one could tell that something was going on with you?
Aisha: I don’t think anyone could tell that something was going on... it changed everything. The first thing was living according to love for myself. And that meant that I spent some time completely dissecting my life in the way where I let everything fall off from myself - which didn’t make sense according to ... my demand for truth.
Rahul: What were some of those things that started falling away?
Aisha: The first thing was the job. At that point, I was living in this suburban house, with this car with the leather seats. I worked in a big international firm. I had a good position there, so I got good money also. But I just saw the dissatisfaction in me that kept rising in me, agreeing to be somewhere that I didn’t feel like it was at all useful in the bigger picture. It felt like a waste of my love, a waste of my time, and of my life - where the only one who benefited from my being there was only me and some company that was based only on making money.
Rahul: So you just quit, right then and there?
Aisha: Actually, even before that there was this demand for love that was sweeping all over, and it became obvious that I just couldn’t find that connection with the guy I was with. But then it became the job that went. And at this point I was a single mother. But I (experienced) this radical demand for things to just make sense.
Birju: Aisha, it sounds like other aspects of your life started to be shed at that same time. Can you share more about that?
Aisha: Every aspect of my life started to shed, because I couldn’t accept that there were places where things didn’t make sense. Actually, it started out over 10 years ... (it came to my consciousness) that question as you stated: “Who am I”? I found out like “hey, what the hell am I doing here? How can I live a life where I was doing one thing but feeling something else?” Right there I had to go with what my heart stated to be true.
Birju: And what did that lead to in terms of action?
Aisha: Ha ha - that’s a long story. Well, I basically started out where I took three weeks where I started looking out over the fields and just feeling “OK, I know I’m not supposed to be at that job anymore, so what am I supposed to do?” It meant that everything started to shift into place - it started to mean that some of the issues that I had started to balance themselves out - like with the snap of the fingers, basically. I saw that my view of what was going on suddenly expanded. And then, in fully willing this, allowing this to be of benefit to everyone. It meant that the moment I acted on this, it brought in greater knowledge. So that was like a constant expansion going on, like for a year and a half, where I went through some very massive spiritual experiences. Like every day, my consciousness was expanding further and further and further. It brought in all sorts of things like the resetting of the mind, trances, all sort of things.
Birju: You had mentioned that this had led to certain aspects of your life spontaneously moving back into balance. Can you share a bit more about what that meant? In a specific field like, say, your life’s work - or relationship?
Aisha: What specific relationships do you mean?
Rahul: It could be relationship with others broadly, or primary relationship if you felt like that was the place where you were in the flow.
Aisha: In allowing myself to live as the love, which is the ground of all being, which is pure light - it also started from there to shave off every aspect of this ... which is the outset of people loving, in the heart. It means that this personal hierarchy of loving started breaking down, one by one, and it meant that the love for everything grows and grows and grows, in that way which basically lifted the way I was viewing that which you would call ‘other’, straight into that love which I have for my son. So it wasn’t like love got left in its turning, from that personal hierarchy into that impersonal where there is only sameness. It was like everything was lifted into the same intimacy of loving everyone and everything, and to be completely naked as soul - and present - and embracing whatever appeared in front of me. It did mean that my doors started opening, and people started appearing - and abilities and stuff - and people started coming to satsangs and for healing at my place. So that became the takeoff for this work.
Aisha: So when you describe this journey, specifically the year and a half that you’ve gone through, it sounds like it was a process you went through on your own, that wasn’t connected to traditional approaches from you know, Christian religious or pathless faith-based approaches. What has been your connection with what we call traditional approaches of going within?
Birju: As it is now, this whole unfolding of pure consciousness, which is basically God consciousness, it’s like a turning up in the fire of life itself, which removed all the [inaudible] ... it’s like whatever religion is there, whatever tradition is there, it has some kind of link into the path. That means that it is that love that is the core of every religion and every tradition - that is basically what it is all about. It’s an invitation to realize self, to realize truth. And in this, in this whole revelation of every dimension of our own being - be that both the true man, in terms of the individual being and its own transparency in terms of ego. Also, it’s a revelation of ourselves to be pure life, in the realization of the pure heart - but also the rest as pure mind, which basically goes beyond existence - and is actually just pure awareness.
Birju: Hmm, would love to hear your thoughts on connecting this into what would conventionally be called ‘creating value’. There are many folks out there - I myself having a business background - who wonder about the value of going within as a primary practice, as it doesn’t seem to touch upon many of the major crises facing humanity today. My boss is a big advocate of working against climate change, and the notion of going within is a little bit confusing as a path to approach that. So what is your interface with those types of people?
Aisha: In the revelation of all the subtle tricks that the ego is playing on the mind, one of the tricks that will be revealed in that going within is what I rever to as the ‘savior syndrome’. In terms of going within, there is no greater gift that can be given to the whole of this entire universe than you realizing yourself. It is like this because that which is looking out can always only do its best by not seeing any kind of full picture. In terms of creating value, the greatest value happens in that surrender, where the want, which is the base of ego, is delivered straight into the fire of pure will, which is the will of the heart. Right there, the realization of one life, one being becomes the revelation of this one being, which then is recognized to be yourself, taking care of itself. It’s just like the software which is installed in the body, clinging to the sense of being an individual, and then doing its best to make some kind of value. If you invert this thinking, right then, there will be a recognition that there’s no one here. But when that recognition is combined with the surrender to pure life, it will also bring the body into its new operating system, where basically it is always operating on what is needed. So in this, there is a complete cleaning up and clearing out of any sign of selfishness which is based on separation.
Birju: I wanted to build off of your answer in being so connected to the idea of surrender, and again, looking at the society and the dominant paradigm - even in myself - there’s a lot of fear. So when you talk about surrendering so wholeheartedly, what is the path? What is the first step that I can work on in being able to surrender in such a way. Because, when I go into the office every day talking about ‘OK, let’s surrender’, it’s a very difficult place to be coming from and expecting people to move on that. Does that make sense?
Aisha: Yes, it does. In what is the actual and best way [inaudible] for some people, it is the embrace of pure mind. For others, they are ready for the heart, for the love and full [...] to develop some kind of healthy ego, which then can be able to hold pure spirit. So it’s a little hard to generalize. Facilitation can basically only happen to the individual. With that said, for the sake of answering, in terms of this surrender, yes, there is a lot of fear. This fear is the working ground of the ego. So how to approach this surrender, there is a call for that which can be underlined as the basic dedication to truth. With this basic dedication to truth, it doesn’t matter where you are at in terms of this whole unfolding, because if you stay with that dedication to truth, it will lead you through every single alley of what needs to dissolve - because this is how the universe works. The universe always shows you, presents to you, brings you into situations where you are presented with that which you are supposed to learn from. So about the fear, it all comes back to ourselves - everything comes back to ourselves. So this thing I call the ‘savior syndrome’ - a call to change the world - was actually a call to change myself. It was an attempt to look out instead of in. The moment there was not that agreement to look out anymore, then I was standing with the fact that the only one who is here is me.
Birju: That leads to a second place of inquiry which comes up for me - this idea of not just surrender, but capacity. Again, picking on myself, I am personally on a journey of asking ‘what is truth?’ So when I come up against hard facts regarding that - let’s say ‘oh, my work is not aligned with my truth’ - I don’t necessarily have the capacity to make a change at that level. So despite that dissonance happening inside of me, I live with that day to day discord rather than act upon it. I’m wondering if you have thoughts on how that capacity can be built?
Aisha: Basically this comes down to surrender. Because when you talk about capacity, surrender is not just a melting down, it’s also within that melting down, a rise of complete clarity. So the moment that there is willingness in you to face your fears, and this willingness comes with your choice of love for yourself, because whether we want it or not, everything is designed by the way that you see the world. So the moment that you insist on this idea of ‘you and other’ and ‘you have to’ and all of this, it’s like your mind is structured in a way where it’s like a completely air solid system (note: she probably means “rock solid”). And this means that if you don’t allow yourself to ask the questions of what is actually true, what is it that I believe - when you say “I don’t have the capacity”, who is making that statement? It can only be an ego making that statement, and then it all comes down to you…taking complete responsibility for you to evolve as truth in you. Because when that choice is made, everything bends according to that dedication. That holding back, that is where you are basically tripping your own legs. So it all comes down to having the guts to stand with what’s right and what’s real for you.
Birju: On that connection you’re between the wish to change at the outer level and the call to change at the inner level, that’s a clarity that I think is not prevalent across most folks. To me, that’s a big prerequiste of wanting to follow through with these actions. How did you get to a space of being clear that in fact, it really is about inner change as the only place.
Aisha: To start, I didn’t know any of this. What I needed to realize was that I didn’t know anything - that my only choice, my only choice was to trust life - that life which, when I stated that I didn’t believe in any of the old things that I used to put up as a world picture. Like “OK, I don’t know what to do, I don’t know who I am, I don’t know anything. So what is my only option? My only option is to listen inwards. And in that listening inwards, there can be confusion for many people. And this confusion comes up with the fear. So once we [note] that there is fear, it is our responsibility not to let the fear control what we do, how we move. It’s not just about an inner inquiry, and it doesn’t separate anything from anything else. If anything, it brings, in its totality, everything into the same reality - and it doesn’t happen until we take the full responsibility of bringing truth into every aspect of our life. If truth is realized from anything other than taking that responsibility, the realization will always become something that is like once removed or off the ground - something which is our reality, but not the reality in which we are living. It just creates another, more subtle aspect of duality. So in the dedication to truth, the dedication needs to be total. When there is not total dedication, then it is always only about [what is] the next step? But in every moment, all of us have it within us to be as truthful, to be as real, to be as loving as possible. It is only when we don’t take this responsibility, this is where fear comes into play, and where surrender doesn’t seem to be an option. Because we all have been “gifted” with the social inheritance, the collective consciousness - everyone has picked up on that.
Birju: So this is the psychological wall that we are all working up against. There’s a lot of collective awareness now of the issues that our collective consciousness has put us into in terms of humanity’s survival on this planet. When we talk about the inner wall as the place to be working, the insurmountability of that wall when we talk about walking into fear, walking into surrender, leads a lot of folks to say “Well, we don’t have time for that. Let’s just get started working out there somewhere.” What would be your response to that?
Aisha: As far as I can see, nothing is excluded from that surrender where we allow ourselves to take care of what’s needed. But the moment that part which is the idea to save the world starts overruling the part of truly giving it our all in terms of allowing things to resolve on our own behalf - it’s very obvious that any work that we do on the world can only come from a place of standing with internal misunderstandings, and then trying to remedy the misunderstanding, by changing what’s around us. If everyone took that responsibility, it would mean that our kids wouldn’t have to listen to consciousness from people who are based in that misunderstanding. It would mean that the people who are living would respond to each other in a responsible manner where it’s not about looking out or pointing out, but looking in and taking full responsibility for that which is not clear on the inside. Right there, the whole temperature of this place changes, simply because every time a finger is pointing out, three fingers are pointing back at yourself. That means that every time we have this obsession with looking out at the world, actually there is 75% call for us to do the work in the inside. It’s not enough for us to change our surroundings when we are still deeply rooted and controlled by the subconscious, which operates on fear. Because then anything that comes up against this fear will still react with the same primitive avoidance, which is basically the movement of most people at his time.
Birju: So given where you’re seeing that at the macro level, and your work has been to engage with that as you work with people, where do you see your own evolving edge, your own questioning right now?
Aisha: My “evolving edge” - what does that mean?
Birju: As you are continuing to grow in your own journey, where are you finding the questions arising within you?
Aisha: Well, in short, for a long time I had really massive surrender going on, to the extent that it burned everything to where I just saw ... basically it ended with the cosmic consciousness, where I slid completely out of the subjective and my eyes turned into the objective. My life has been operating from there for a long time. It did mean that I started operating as a spiritual teacher, but basically it was just moving around, sensing the seeds ... of like opening hearts everywhere - like the initiation to the purification of heart. However it did end up being called in solitude. And in that solitude, there was this complete implosion of self, or of God or whatever, into pure space. This took a while, then in the return from that, there has been an ongoing return of life, which has meant a merging between all and nothing, in that way which reemerges subjectivity, but from that place of complete vulnerability. I can say at this point in time that the God realization and the truth realization are merging into the true man in that way which basically means the embodiment of pure life and pure consciousness. In that way, it just [puts me in a functional place] for people, in terms of assisting them on their way to truth.
Rahul: As we as audience members and beyond start walking into this journey of surrender ourselves, at an external level, when we talk about this love essence that happening internally, what are things that can be taken on externally - small or large - that would aid the surrendering process within?
Aisha: Basically, it’s about everything. Nothing can be ruled out. What I saw through the time of surrendering is that it’s not enough to surrender just in terms of myself as an individual. It also means that every relationship needs to be surrendered. And when I say ‘surrendered’ I mean that everything needs to be embraced in truth in the same way. And that means that we need to allow ourselves to live the cleanliness which is the simplicity of natural life. It means allowing the things to fall off which are based on something ... ha, I don’t remember the exact words ... something that is just entertainment. Anything which is just living for itself in its own selfishness must be invited into the same reality where there is care, care for everything.
Rahul: I’m wondering if there’s a skillful approach, externally, that allows for the unfolding of the truth of the everything that you’re referring to. For instance, if you say ‘Ok yes, everything needs to be changed” even if that were true, for many folks, that would be such a hard pill to swallow. Is there a place externally that is almost like a Pandora’s Box, where, if you start going deeper into a concrete action - whatever it is - [for example] make sure you breath in the morning before you go to work - or whatever it is - where eventually the layers of delusion start to unfold on their own?
Aisha: What you’re asking me for is a new religion. I cannot give it to you because every single ego is so magnificently put together that we each have our own places where we are tricking ourselves. And this means that there cannot be put out a basic teaching. There can be the facilitation of people right where they are tripping their own legs, where they are resisting their own surrender. So no, I cannot state anything in that regard.
Well, it’s very helpful to have your background for continuing to have us focus inwards as we continue all of our journeys.
Aisha: Yes, definitely. If anything, it can only be stated as a larger thing, as taking that full responsibility for allowing life to be the case instead of the identification with somebody.
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Aisha lives in Denmark and runs a retreat center where she offers deep healing and meditation sessions to individuals. ...