In an age where pop stars are born over night and cast aside just as quickly, it is not only a refreshing but humbling experience talking to Matt Barnes – aka Forest Swords. Matt released his debut EP back in 2011 and after receiving an abundance of praise and interest from the music industry he decided to call it a day, naturally. So when the news that his powerful and intense music would be making a return in the form of new album Engravings, members of the music industry sat up and listened with eager ears.
Not only is this approach to the world of music and his definition of success unique, but his music is also just as individual. It is moody, angst-ridden, hopeful and intoxicating all at the same time. There is a James Blake feel to the turbulence of the album with a similarity of tangibility in beauty and emotion, however it is somewhat darker and in a sense more raw than Blake.
Read our interview with the Liverpudlian to find out a bit more about his music, his city and what brings tears to his eyes.
WHY THE NAME FOREST SWORDS, IS THAT YOUR ALTER EGO?
I wouldn’t say it was an alter ego, I would say its more of a project name. When you record under a different name there’s less pressure. It just means you can kind of view things as more of a fully formed sphere and it’s less about you and more about what you’re making. In terms of the name, I made my first EP two years ago and it wasn’t until I actually finished the music and listened back to it that I tried to find words and phases that fit with it aesthetically and sonically. I thought it was quite a nice fit and I just carried on from there really.
SO YOU TRY AND KEEP YOUR PROJECTS SEPARATE TO WHO YOU ARE, IS THAT SOMETHING THAT YOU DO CONSCIOUSLY BECAUSE YOU’RE MAYBE A SHY PERSON OR YOU FEEL THAT IT HINDERS THE CREATIVE PROCESS?
I think a lot of it is to do with being a designer because that’s my bread and butter. Being a designer I think in projects and in a modular way so I’m quite used to having a finite amount of time with something so being able to think about that musically is quite helpful. I wouldn’t say it makes it less personal because it’s still very intense to make and I still have an emotional connection with it. Just doing it under a pseudonym and a project name kind of eases things up a bit, it gives you a bit more leeway to push things in different directions. There comes a lot of responsibility and weight when you do something under your own name and there’s room for maneuver when you have a project name, it means I can bring in other musicians in future if I wanted to or I could do various different things.
IS THAT SOMETHING YOU CAN SEE YOURSELF DOING IN THE FUTURE?
I’ve got no immediate plans for it but I like the idea that I could do that. There’s always a possibility that you could do anything.
YOUR DEBUT EP WAS RELEASED BACK IN 2011 SO IT’S TAKEN YOU A COUPLE OF YEARS TO MAKE YOUR LATEST ALBUM ENGRAVINGS. WHY DID YOU DECIDE TO MAKE IT?
I actually wasn’t going to make another record. I made a full EP and I thought it would be quite interesting just to leave it at that. But over time I gradually got snippets of melodies and beats and I could see things appearing. The more I worked on things the more I thought “Oh actually I might have another EP here or I might have an album”. So it was a very gradual process and it wasn’t a conscious thing where I sat down and thought “right I’ve got to make an album now”. As soon as you get an EP that gets some attention or you get a first release you’re kind of expected to jump on that treadmill, so I kind of thought it would be a nice thing to just leave it. But the more I started making new stuff, the more I got into it and the more I thought it might be quite a cool thing to take that sound and refine it and play around with it and create a full length. So it was a very gradual, it took about 18 months all in all and I’m really happy with how it’s turned out.
IN YOUR OPINION IS THAT THE RIGHT KIND OF WAY TO MAKE AN ALBUM, OVER THAT AMOUNT OF TIME? IS THERE A DANGER OF JUST CHURNING IT OUT?
Yeah, absolutely and I think doing it outside of a record deal as well was really helpful. I know a lot of artists don’t necessarily get that freedom to do their own thing because they’ve always got a label breathing down their neck or they have these imposed deadlines to work with. Whereas I just had my own time scale and that could be as long or short as I wanted, I didn’t feel any particular pressure from anyone to create it or to have it sound like anything. So that was very helpful.
TO TAKE THAT FURTHER WOULD YOU SAY THAT YOU CREATE THE MUSIC FOR YOURSELF AND AS AN EXPRESSION OF YOUR FEELINGS OR IS IT FOR OTHERS TO LISTEN TO AND ENJOY?
That’s an interesting question actually. I’ve never really thought about it that much. I think you ultimately do it to please yourself and you want to try things out. As an artist you want to push things forward a little bit and widen your scope of what your doing and your practice and your craft. But I was also very conscious about making something that could really connect with people on a level and I was very interested in exploring emotional resonance in music this time round. Even though I was pleased with my first EP, I thought it was quite cold in places and listening back to it I wanted something people could really feel and could really latch onto the energy of. So that’s partly why it took a long time because I spent a lot of time tweaking sounds and tweaking melodies to make it feel a lot more emotionally impactable for me. Something that’s missing in a lot of electronic music now a days is that emotional connection. So the majority of the music making process is for me because I have to do it, I have to enjoy it and I have to play it live, I have to actually like the songs. Then I guess about 25% is for other people. The more you start making music to please other people the less weight and conviction the music has, the more it feels like you compromised to please someone. Whereas I was very much out of that mind set, I didn’t really want to please anyone with it but I definitely wanted to create something that people could connect with even if they didn’t like it. It’s quite an interesting thing to talk back on because a lot of making a record like that is such an internal decision making process and its only until you start doing interviews and start talking about it that things start becoming a lot clearer and the fog kind of lifts a little bit, you can see more clearly how you approached it.
IT WAS RECENTLY ANNOUNCED THAT YOU WOULD BE PLAYING AT SEMIBREVE FESTIVAL. WAS THERE ANYTHING IN PARTICULAR THAT ATTRACTED YOU TO THAT PARTICULAR FESTIVAL?
The venue looked amazing. Whenever I book shows I always check out the venue beforehand, I always go on Google images to make sure it looks good. I don’t want to be playing venues that I don’t think will suit the music or suit the visuals; I don’t really see the point in doing that. I’m very picky when it comes to places that I play and then I looked at the past line ups and thought “do I fit into that?”. They also seemed really responsive to having me on so I’m excited.
ITS INTERESTING YOU SAY THAT THE VISUALS ARE IMPORTANT BECAUSE YOU WERE INITIALLY A GRAPHIC DESIGNER. HOW DO YOU SEE THIS RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN SOUND AN ART, ARE THERE DEFINITIVE BOUNDARIES OR DO YOU SEE THEM AS ONE AND THE SAME?
I think in my head there’s no difference. I think more for the viewer there is, for the viewer I guess it’s important to have a fully formed world that people can explore and delve into. Everything from the packaging to the live visuals to the sound, there are threads running through it and I think people connect with music and artists a lot more when it’s like that. As a music fan I do as well, but in terms of making it there’s really no difference for me. It’s just a creative process that has a product at the end of it and hopefully those things fit together. The way I approach music is very much from a design point of view, it’s very much about layers and colours and texture, so there are definite similarities between them both.
GOING FROM GRAPHIC DESIGN TO MUSIC, WOULD YOU HAVE AN ADVICE FOR PEOPLE WHO WANT TO MAKE MUSIC BUT FIND THAT IT DOESN’T COME AS NATURALLY AS THEY HOPE?
I would say don’t be afraid of anything really just try and explore sounds. You don’t need expensive equipment to do it, my set up is incredibly rudimentary and basic. I think it’s all about having fun with sound and exploring, trying to push things forward as much as you can without losing sight of what you want it to sound like and your vision for it. It can be a difficult process and it can be quite stressful but I think it should always be fun; you should always enjoy what you’re doing.
DID YOU ENJOY MAKING YOUR NEW ALBUM?
Not entirely no. I found it quite stressful in parts and I started to realise how much of a perfectionist I am. When you spend so long on something various things about your personality and your character start to make themselves apparent. So I was definitely conscious that there’s a lot more of a perfectionist in me but then I’m also really bad at making decisions so it’s like the worst combination. I’m a perfectionist about most things and then I couldn’t decide what was the right thing. But the more time you spend in that world and the more you immerse yourself in your own music you find your own path, so it does get easier as time goes on. I did enjoy it and I’m pleased with the end products.
DO YOU THINK GROWING UP AND LIVING IN LIVERPOOL HAS SHAPED NOT JUST YOUR MUSIC BUT YOU AS A PERSON? DO YOU THINK LOCATION HAS A LOT TO DO WITH WHO YOU ARE OR WOULD YOU SAY YOUR CRAFT WOULD HAVE BEEN THE SAME ANYWHERE?
No I think it’s definitely been shaped by where I’m from. Liverpool is a very singular city in that it’s very stubborn in a way. There are a lot of bands that are very comfortable in their place here so that creates a very interesting DIY scene and you have lots of cross overs with different artists and bands. I think the interesting thing about Liverpool for me is that it has such a huge history of slightly weird music going right back to psychedelic music or 80s pop. There’s a lot of weird stuff that has come out of the city like crazy punk bands or avant-garde noise bands or whatever but there’s always this underlying appreciation of pop music and of melody and I don’t necessarily understand where that comes from. It might be the maritime thing, I don’t know but it’s inherently a very musical city. I think it has shaped my music and it’s made me not afraid to try things out. It’s quite difficult to describe because it is a very unique city in that the music scene is quite small but the things that are going on are mind blowing. It never really gets attention outside of Liverpool a lot of the time and people seem happy with that. It’s kind of a weird one as well because it’s hard to be objective about it when you’re here but I don’t think my music would sound or feel like it does if it wasn’t for Liverpool. I grew up going to shows here and I saw loads of cool bands pass through various venues here, there was one venue in particular called Korova. The DIY spaces and the gallery spaces that pop up mean it’s a very independent city, we kind of just get on with things here and that’s very inspiring as a creative person.
WHAT WAS THE LAST THING THAT MADE YOU CRY?
Oh wow! That’s a curve ball question, shit let me think. I tend to cry at things that are really beautiful rather than sad. It’s always happy tears. I’m a big fan of nice views and there have been lots of nice views that have reduced me to tears. I was in Chicago recently and there’s a big path that goes around by Lake Michigan. It gives this incredible city view at night and it’s just the most beautiful thing, I think I probably shed a tear at that. I’m not a very sad, weepy person so I can’t think of a sad thing but definitely a view has reduced me to tears more than once. It’s kind of what I try and do with my music a lot of the time, that fine line between something that’s really sad, and euphoria. There’s a very interesting power balance between them both and they kind of veer between each other so you can have a sound that’s very bleak but it can also have this sense of euphoria about it, there’s a very interesting line and grey area between them I think.
Find out more about Forest Swords on his website.
Forest Swords will be playing at Semibreve Festival in Portugal which runs from 15th-17th November.
Event details below:
15 November
Philip Jeck + Lol Sargent (9:30pm)
Helm (10:40pm)
Raime (11:50pm)
16 November
The Haxan Cloak (9:30pm)
Rafael Toral: Space Collective 3 (10:40pm)
Forest Swords (11:50pm)
17 November
Atom™ (6:30pm)
Sculpture (7:30pm)
+ an installation called “Love song” by Janek Schaefer
Find out more on their website.
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