cartechboy writes
"The electric car challenge is what insiders call "getting butts in seats" — and a lot of butts today still belong to humans who are not yet buying electric cars. The big question is: Why? Surveys show drivers are interested in electric cars--and that they love them once they drive them. EVs also cost less to maintain (though more to buy in the first place) and many experts say they're simply nicer to drive. So what's the problem? Disinterested dealers, uneven distribution, limited supplies, and media bias are some potential challenges. Or maybe it's just lousy marketing--casting electric cars as a moral imperative or a duty, like medicine you have to take."
Re:I'll buy one...
By blue trane
•
2013-Nov-23 00:11
• Score: 4, Funny
• Thread
Reagan proved deficits don't matter. The Fed just expands its balance sheet to buy govt bonds, taxes aren't even necessary. Then govt uses fiscal policy to subsidize wages so there's no wage-price spiral inflation. Electric car companies produce cars with a low payroll liability, and govt further subsidizes the cost for the consumer because it's a good idea and helps society. Everybody wins.
it's the price, stupid.
By markhahn
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2013-Nov-23 00:28
• Score: 3
• Thread
My daily commute is less than 10km, and I would love to have and affordable, safe, less-consumptive/polluting vehicle. I would be very tempted by a car-like EV that was very small and light with range 50km if it cost something like $5-7k. (for $10k I can get a small used ICE that burns absurdly little gas.) It has to be able to take me up a decent-sized hill at 50 kph, though. An in-town EV could make a lot of sense, market-wise, but I think it should be purposed-designed, not just an ICE vehicle with a the engine swapped out.
Otherwise, the problem is that EV or hybrids try to deliver long range and highway performance and wind up simply being too expensive. Hybrids in particular wind up carrying so much extra weight that you can usually do better pure EV *xor* ICE. It doesn't make sense to pretend that the technology supports non-premium EVs yet (Tesla is great, but it's a sports car at sports car prices.) In some sense, the problem is that petroleum ICE sets a high bar of energy density. I often wonder if there's a place for an EV that has an optional IDE add-in module for range (maybe fuel cell some day, maybe petroleum+turbine today or just a conventional diesel.)
Re:2 Words
By FlyHelicopters
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2013-Nov-23 00:54
• Score: 4, Interesting
• Thread
None of the EVs are actually price-competitive at purchase time without a big rebate.
This is indeed the primary problem. I can afford an EV, I can afford to spend $20K more on an EV if I wanted to. But I didn't get to where I am by making emotional decisions with money. When it makes economic sense, I'll be first in line to buy an EV, I do believe they are the future. Burning dead dinos in our cars and trucks really has no long term future in it.
On the other hand, the Denali's name is a barely-transposed acronym. Get a smaller car.
Actually, I use every bit of it... I have 3 kids, and we're often driving around their friends as well, plus hauling stuff. I also use it for work, picking up and dropping off computer equipment.
I know that some people buy a truck like that and drive it around empty, but in my case, I really do need the space, both for kids and for cargo.
Re:2 Words
By JWSmythe
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2013-Nov-23 00:59
• Score: 5, Insightful
• Thread
Lets compare..
The Chevrolet and Nissan cars, straight from their sites. These are all "starting from..." prices. We could compare options all day. I've excluded the high end sports cars (Corvette and GT-R respectively)
$12,170 Spark
$14,170 Sonic
$17,270 Cruze
$22,140 Malibu
$23,555 Camaro
--- Average ---
$26,860 Impala
$34,185 Volt <--- EV
$43,475 SS
Chevrolet "average" is $24,228
Nissan
$11,990 Versa Sedan
$13,990 Versa Note
$15,990 Sentra
$16,760 Cube
$22,010 Altima Sedan
--- Average ---
$25,230 Altima Coupe
$28,800 Leaf <--- EV
$29,990 370Z Coupe
$31,000 Maxima
$35,110 Pathfinder Hybrid
$41,470 370Z Roadster
Nissan "average" is $24,758
Really, a $1,190 difference between a Leaf and a 370Z? $19.83/mo difference with 60 month financing? A buyer would switch up the the 370Z if they want performance, or they'll happily save $3,570 by going down to the Altima Coupe.
The same applies to Chevy, except stepping down to a gas car saves $7,325. Stepping up is a bit more expensive.
The EVs are a great idea. They aren't priced to sell to most consumers. They're priced to sell to people who want to brag they have an EV, much like pricing on high end sports cars.
I *want* an EV. If I had to buy a new car today, I wouldn't buy one. Besides the above average costs, I see longevity being a problem. The car I have now is over 10 years old. I have serious doubts in the longevity of the current EVs, and part replacement costs. As I understand it, the Volt battery pack is $8,000. Nissan Leafs batteries cost $15,000. Nissan has a payment plan deal, which still ends up costing you thousands.
There are other pesky issues, like the cost of recharging.
Re:2 Words
By FlyHelicopters
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2013-Nov-23 01:10
• Score: 4, Informative
• Thread
They do? Which one? The Tesla Model S? What car do you think it compares to in terms of price, luxury, size, etc?
For the 80K price, I could buy a pair of Cadillac XTS's!